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FERNANDO OLIVA   03/10/2003	Subject: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION Message: Dear Mark: I like very much Raff 7th. Symphony "In den Alpen". When we should read this Symphony explanation in the "Works in detail" Section? Thanks in advance. Fernando.
Mark   03/10/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Well, curiously enough I was thinking about writing a page on the 7th. for this month's update - but I decided against it in favour of one of the Piano Trios. I have already written about several of the symphonies but only one of the trios. Since you've asked, however, I'll make sure the 7th. is the next symphony to be added. Best wishes,
FERNANDO OLIVA   03/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Dear Mark, Thanks a lot for including 7th. "Alpina" Symphony on the Close -Up Section. You surely remember I like very much this work. I often listen it, specially when I am going to the mountains. I was mountaineer until a few years, today I still go rambling mountains but many seriously. Strauss Alpina, is a chronicle about peak climbing. But Raff 7th. really explains to us about the people who live on the mountain regions. And also Raff explained about one of the most better high-mountain landscape: the lake. This movement makes me feel good. I am also angler, and like very much fly-fishing trout. Let me give to you congratulations for this work, first as a Classical Music afecionate and second as a Mountaineer. Kind regards from Barcelona, Fernando.
Mark   04/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Well, thanks for your thanks, Fernando. I never used to like the work when all I knew of it was the Marco Polo recording. It seemed a bit of a lumbering beast. However, I was lucky enough to experience a live performance a couple of years ago (there's a review here somewhere) and it quite "came alive" - especially the slow movement and the finale. I still think that the opening movement would make much more impact were it, say, five minutes shorter - but that's not what Raff wrote. Your comparison with Strauss' Alpine Symphony is spot on - for all its surface effect, the Strauss work is a much shallower piece. That said, I have always loved it too. Best wishes...
John Boyer   05/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: If Strauss's Alpine Symphony is shallower than Raff's 7th, then depth is clearly not a virtue.
Mark   05/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Do you rate the Strauss as "great music" then, John? When I want a good wallow, I'm very fond of the work but it's rather a guilty enjoyment. Its chocolate box effects and literal scene painting are what make it shallow for me. Call me a musical snob by all means, but the line of musical good taste stops some way this side of a wind machine! That isn't, by the way, to imply that the Raff is superior work. It remains one of the weaker sisters amongst his symphonies.
John Boyer   06/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Strauss's Alpine Symphony is not great music, but it is better music than Raff's 7th. It doesn't matter that Raff takes the high road and Strauss the low one while they stroll through the Alps. What matters is the quality of the journey and its outcome. Strauss's extravagant excursion, low road notwithstanding, is a delight, a real trip (pun intended). Raff's journey, however lofty his goal and high his road, is something of a dud. He keeps his dignity and guides us home, but we don't have much fun along the way.
Mark   06/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: John, I think that I'll make a dignified strategic withdrawal on this one - I think that you've put things very well. I must admit that I DO enjoy Strauss' piece more than Raff's. Damn...
FERNANDO OLIVA   10/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Hello, Talking only about Strauss Alpina, I always like this work, but many of other tone poems (for me Alpina is a big tone poem). It´s so far the fresh and full of innovation "Don Juan" and don´t have the originality and virtuosity of "Don Quixote", but Alpina is better than the very bored "Zaratrusta" and much better than "Domestic Symphony". By times, great and glimmering orchestration, can hide banal or bored themes. Curiously, one of my "Strauss" favorite, is "Hero´s Life", despite its simplicity and its "auto-potpourri" 3rd. movement "A peace Hero´s works". Kind regards from Barcelona, Soon wil be in Christmas... Fernando.
Jamie   10/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: In my opinion, Ein Heldenleben is one of the most overrated, bloated, and vulgar compositions I know. As an alternative, I would suggest Dvorak's "Pisen Bohatyrska" or "Hero's Song", opus 111. It's his last symphonic poem and the only one without a detailed program. It is sadly neglected like the other 4 symphonic poems ("Vodnik"--The Water Sprite", "Polednice"--The Noonday Witch", Holoubek"--"The Wood Dove", and my favorite, "Zlaty Kolovrat"--"The Golden Spinning Wheel"). In all my concertgoing years, the only one I've seen performed is "The Wood Dove", at a memorable concert where Coleridge-Taylor's "Hiawatha's Wedding Feast" and excerpts from Victor Herbert's grand opera "Natoma" were also on the program.
John Boyer   11/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Good to read that someone appreciates those lovely Dvorak tone poems. My favorite (though they are all good) is "The Golden Spinning Wheel" too! And I even heard it in concert: Springfield (Mass) Symphony under Robert Gutter, c. 1982-3. As for "Ein Heldenleben"...I have a soft spot for it. The only one of his tone poems I don't like is "Zarathustra". Nice beginning, but it gets lost terribly fast.
FERNANDO OLIVA   11/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Dear Friends, I agree with John about Zaratrusta: "Nice beginning but..." I like all the Dvorak tone poem I ever listen: -The Goblin -Husistká (Les Husites) -My Home and I also like very much his Overture "Carnaval". Cheers, Fernando
Jamie   11/12/2003	RE: RAFF´S "ALPINA" IN THE Works in detail SECTION IP: Logged Message: Fernando, of the Dvorak works you mentioned, only the Water Goblin is a tone poem. The others are overtures. Carnaval is the most popular, though like New World symphony, there are better choices. I much prefer Othello (of the In Nature's Realm-Carnaval-Othello trilogy), though I wish Dvorak had stuck with his original titles--Nature, Life, and Love. Again, other than Carnaval, you never hear the others or shorter works like the Scherzo Capriccioso or Symphonic Variations which is a terrible shame. How can poor Raff ever have his day when such excellent works of a well-known master are also utterly neglected?